Wow. Interesting actually. That’s a very long story for not a lot to show for it. Seems unfortunate so many resources were not invested in advancing technology more.
I just never paid that much attention to either StarVR (because the resolution seemed severely lacking) or IMAX (because it was more of a defacto very loose specification than anything else).
I thought it might be an interesting read. I guess the bottom line is vr headsets are not easy to manufacture in volume. Not many companies manufacturing this type of product in any volume.
Even fewer actually pushing higher resolution and higher FOV it seems, unfortunately.
Now that we’re sharing Starbreeze stories: one of the original 3 StarVR developers came to the forum almost 1.5 year ago. I talked to him about how they had solved distortion for the StarVR, he claimed it was actually quite easy to solve. I asked him if he was interested in helping pimax fix their distortion problems, he said he was open to that. Extremely excited about this superb opportunity, communication with Pimax China was done, their answer was ‘there IS no distortion problem in our headsets’, which felt a bit like the communist regime claiming there was no radiation, when the reactor in Pripyat had exploded.
But oh well, it seems Pimax actually might have figured out themselves how to fix the distortion. Really looking forward to the reports at CES 2022, might even go myself!
i like that pimax pushing vr forward,BUT first i must see if they can deliver.
They anounced too many things,and i dont think they can deliver that in good quality(ofcourse i hope so)
We will see where this goes,i dont hope it will be a disaster,because the 8kx is a nice product(with its flaws ofcourse) and that people trade it in for the new headset and will be disapointed…
We will see… i hope they will suprise us…
Kevin I was not striking out just stating (also from past experience) that things have been stated then corrected. Then sometimes changed again. As you may recall I have been around these forums as long as you possibly. I am a fan. I’m sure it is very difficult to plan an event as large as this announcement. Im sure there are lots of logistics to work out on the trade in program or what ever it turns out to be. I would not expect any company to share all internal plans with its customers or competition for this part. Pimax has been generous on this all along and maybe share to much at times. Just stating this may be one of those times. The announcement was great and exciting. Maybe announcing the price would have been fine alone without complicating it with a non finalized plan on the buy back program. I understand the marketing strategy to sell more headsets now. All of us fans that have been along for the ride and you yourself deserve clear information to prevent confusion and backlash. Maybe keeping the buyback info to yourselves and announcing it closer to CES when more refined would have made things easier on all of us. We had a lot of excitement seeing the announcements, there is a lot to digest. Just saying you your superiors and Sweviver should have a very precise message to deliver when the time is right. No confusion, no mixed messages just what it is. I truly am a fan and supporter. I have been patient and understanding with all of the past events. I will remain patient and look forward to see the great products Pimax delivers from all the hard work everyone of you have put in. I respect you and your team. All i ask is to please respect us too. Deliver the information when in fact what we hear is what it is.
I didn’t think anything negative about your comment - just wanted to mention that we do have detailed roadmaps and other plans, some of which are years in the making.
At the event we put out a huge amount of information. Some here thought we would withhold most of it but we revealed all sorts of info that went beyond specifications but even included some of the process we went through to create the parts and arrive at what combinations would yield the best result.
Since it’s a new platform the event *could have been a lot longer but we really worked hard to keep it at 1 hour and at the same time try to provide a compelling event worth watching. Hopefully the vr community will tune in next time too.
I think we were competitive with the other events that occurred around the same timeframe.
The only piece not detailed was the mechanism that will be involved to receive credit for existing headset owners. There have been questions about it but so far no backlash as after all the new device won’t ship for a while.
I think because a) we don’t have a pre-order portal or any system to collect on advance orders and b) we incorporated time for pimax owners to read reviews, hands-on etc. before they choose to upgrade and c) it’s quite a generous offer that benefits anyone with a pimax headset are the reasons why its well received. We’ll probably get the mechanisms out before CES which is getting close.
Thank you, and you have my interests. I hope there is a clear road map for you and the origination, free of the troubles of the past. I look forward to all of it and hope my system at the time of release can handle it. Your timing on the reveal did catch everyones attention and may have been appropriate. The news on the vr front has heated up and was well due after a bit of a slump. Looking forward to CES for sure.
This is the really big one to me. Giving a full year after the release of the 12K to make the trade-in upgrade speaks a lot to me about the level of confidence you have in the product.
So… Here’s a silly thought…
I think somebody mentioned something about maybe arranging try-out events again, like before kickstarter devices started shipping, which is nice, but not everybody may be able to travel on designated dates…
With a year to go, I have no idea how many months it may be, until Pimax will be receiving production samples of the new lenses, but maybe, as soon as they do, they could set aside a handful, for assembling by the singles together with a translucent gel at screen depth, either in regular “eyetubes”, if those are also done molding by that time, or 3D-printed substitutes, if they are not.
The resulting lupe-like assemblies would be for holding up to a light and peering into, held at the right angle, just to see how the lenses seem to work for you; Your eyes, and maybe using your eyeglasses. -If I can easily read tiny text and test patterning printed on the gel, a fair bit away from the centre of the lens, then maybe I have an indication that at least this one most crucial component, of the many, many which could turn out to be showstoppers, in the new devices, does seem to be a good fit for me and my specific physiognomy.
Sell these here on the forum, as cheaply as possible, and we forum members could arrange between us, to form groups sharing one, passing it on from one to the next by domestic mail.
Just a random thought…
i just thought of something.
So the 12K features sound crazy cool. But something is bothering me.
With all of these super high tech vr 3.0 features, has Pimax actually bothered to add a VR 1.0 feature of having a proximity sensor in between the lenses to detect when you put on the device?
This has always seemed like a complete oversight .
i still want to know how we will run the pimax 12k?Because its still almost impossible to run the pimax 8kx good on a rtx3090? @PimaxUSA
It’s imposible playing MSFS2020 in VR with any headset but still ppl compromising and playing.
I want it becouse already supersampling my sims up to 3300p vert. with my 3080ti and at Q4 2022 we will have 40xx gfx line
I’ve said the new headsets use a new version of DFR called FT. You can read about FT here: Press releases - Tobii
It comes integrated in every headset. Also smaller pixels = less supersampling. Saying it’s almost impossible to run good on an 8KX with a 3090 is just plain false btw. You can run at near the maximum FPS in the VAST majority of games on an 8KX. MSFS2020 is probably the hardest to run but you can even get that running smooth as shown by the VRFlightsimguy.
Further even for the hardest games we now have techniques such as FSR, DLSS and now our new integrated compulsive mode to have smooth gameplay.
Popular games like DCS, iRacing, No Mans Sky and others have *removed the need for PP to be enabled as well. So games themselves are also getting in on the action. Not a lot of games need it anymore.
Ok, a statement like that can just not be allowed to go unquestioned.
After those words, I’d like you to personally demonstrate how to get each and every one out of this vast majority of games running at 75fps, without severe paring down of graphical fidelity; And synthetic frames do not count - at all, nor does upscaling – neither of those is “running well” anything - they are the duct tape you wrap hapazardly around your shattered legs, so that you can hobble along at all, even if under excruciating pain.
I am delighted to see foveated transport finally becoming a thing in the VR world (a simpler, and fixed version of that was incidently one of those things which were asked (unanswered) about here on this forum, before p8k and p5k started shipping).
I would not call Foveated Transport a: “version” of Foveated Rendering, though - rendering and transport are two completely separate matters, and you could foveate either, without foveating the other.
Each also has completely different sets of modes, of varying effectiveness/tradeoffs, of actually achieving the desired reductions in work load, or volumes of data that need to be transferred.
Will Tobii’s foveated transport implementation for the p12k enable it to receive frames that, uncompromised, fully utilise the display panel resolution for the fovea part of the view, and sufficient definition for the rest of it; At frame rates that meet its 200Hz maximum refresh rate; And at full FOV; Without any further compromises or trickery - technological or semantic? In practice - not hypothetically.
I wish I were less inclined to sound so harsh, but, you know, Pimax users have lived though a fairly long history of uncovering endless undisclosed caveats.
It is great that you have managed to get some developers to begin adapting to a wide FOV future - hopefully more will see the light, and hopefully do so in more and better ways; Non-PP is just the first step. …and hopefully this will include standards, frameworks, VR runtimes, GPU drivers, and engines, providing application developers with the tools they need to do this, without having to reinvent the wheel themselves every time, and for each and every target device. :7
Mine runs fine , but I suppose fine is Relative to expectations, what your playing and acceptance level.
Yours seems to be “I must run everything max spec at all times, no tricks like smoothing, upscaling or using smaller FOV modes”. its native resolution all sliders maxxed or nothing." Sorry, not how PC gaming has ever worked…“with great power over graphic sliders comes great responsibility”
I for one am happy they are aiming ahead of the curve because alot might happen in terma of GPU hardware available by the time 12K is released.
True future proofing us staying ahead of the competition.
Everyone knows when shooting a moving target you must lead the target. Shoot straight at it and you miss. (Doesn’t help that half the rounds Pimax uses are blanks or faulty shells that blow up in your face … but that’s a totally different and more important topic)
In terms of raw power: From my 1080Ti, the 3090 doubles frame rate – I need ten times more grunt to run ye olde Skyrim at settings I’d like, at a mere 100 degrees FOV…
Going by that historic progress rate, I can’t imagine we’ll see any quantum leap in the brute force department (prove me wrong, GPU makers, please), but maybe some new techniques could make rendering more efficient, or better at faking things – question there, is how deeply application developers would need to code specifically for those paradigms, and how much of it would turn out to (again) be locked behind proprietary APIs/HW core functions.
I do also have to agree I think the 8k X runs pretty good on the majority of games I play with my 3080. I should mention, however, I largely do NOT play sims, which are often among the most demanding titles. Most stuff I am not playing completely maxed out, no. But things like Pavlov, Skyrim(Quite heavily modded), Project Wingman, heavily modded Assetto Corsa, all those have ran on at least upper medium or better, most of them on high and Pavlov 100% maxed out, with high FPS that’s usually 70+ even without FSR and on large FoV.
The only game I play which it feels needed to drop to normal FoV or a large amount of settings in order to get even playable FPS is Blade and Sorcery on some modded maps. I’ll sometimes drop to normal FoV on other stuff depending on certain content, but for the most part I don’t feel as if I would really need to.
You get it. PC gaming is all about compromise. I almost never play anything on Ultra settings.
I remember when the thought of running Crysis on max on a 1080p screen was considered lunacy.
Now it works on a handheld on batteries.
Textures aside, since that’s almost all VRAM and it shows a hell of a lot more in VR, ultra settings are often a waste of resources anyway for almost no gain anyway.