A note about the perfomance issues on this forum

We are all reading about the high demands of the Pimax. This is only one data point, but I have a strong suspicion it’s going to help people, so I’m starting a thread about it. That said, all the usual provisos apply of, my opinion, not a computer scientist, mileage may vary, bla bla bla…

Essentially I am seeing people with much better gear than me suffering with hindered performance on their 8K and 5K+. Additionally, a lot of people are having lots of issues with operation of the pimax software- both in terms of operation and updates/installation.

After spending years playing with windows installs in various VM’s, I am pretty convinced that a well loaded up standard windows 10 installation is at the heart of many of these issues. Before my new SFPC build, I was running an FX9590 with a 1080ti and had great performance with pretty much any title I threw at it. My 3d modeling was a big driver for my rebuild, plus given my rig was about 6 years old, the upgrade paths for AM3 were long gone. Plus I knew the 1080ti wasn’t being well served on this platform. But I digress…

I probably shouldn’t be broadcasting this, but despite owning several W10 licenses, I decided to move to LTSB around 2016. When you install this build, you will find something like 55 to 60 processes running, as opposed to the usual 120+. I also disable a lot of stuff- including pretty much all of the nvidia console stuff. If I want to adjust a setting or look at FPS- I might turn some stuff on, play around and turn things off. The other thing I do is after installing windows I manually install all of the c++ redistributables. Then I let the system update. Many attest to the optimization of W10, but my experience indicates there’s a limit.

I have run more slipstreamed setups, but I feel this is a moderate, but focused approach. I run most games in the full FOV, with cranked in-game details. I don’t crank the SteamVR SS override, but my Pimax is usually wide FOV and 1.75 on pretty much all the VR I play. I am not watching FPS all the time, but I can thrash my head around, and I rarely see any stutter or any indication of frames dropping into, say, the 30fps range. As the software goes, it installed perfectly and it has never crashed. Not after firmware or software updates. I installed it ONCE.

The other thing I do is run portable versions of applications every chance I get. I am running a LOT of programs on my machine, yet there isn’t a single background updater or service that doesn’t need to be there. I feel that all of this put together is giving me a bit more out of my hardware. And for those who care about the look of the OS, I do run a custom skin with custom icons and rainmeter. If you think all this cutting back makes my machine look like a win98 potato- don’t. My OS looks as sexy as anything on r/battlestations. Don’t ask me about the desk, tho… :slight_smile:

So if you are feeling desperate that for some inexplicable reason your i9/2080ti is just barely cutting it with the Pimax, I STRONGLY urge you to get your hands on LTSB. Get all the c++ redist’s in there. Go as portable as you can manage. Yes they take an extra 1.5 seconds to load but on modern CPU’s the performance hit is negligible. Obviously older rigs like an i7/1080 would benefit even more. If you feel like you need to rebuild for your Pimax, that’s cool but definitely give this a go if you are not jazzed at the thought of dropping hundreds (or thousands) on a new rig.

PS- The other bonus of portable applications is that you will never re-install again. If you wipe your machine, keep a copy of your portable installations (I keep it all in one folder) and just DRAG AN DROP. Boom. Installations back online as if nothing ever happened. I can wipe my machine and be back online in a couple hours. An installation image would be faster, but I personally like to update my apps and OS everytime I refresh. I usually do it once or twice a year. I never have random CTD or bluescreen.


I’ve never even heard of that before. For the convenience of everyone who hasn’t heard of LTSB, here’s a link for more info:
. FAQ: Windows 10 LTSB explained | Computerworld

It’s apparently available for a $7 monthly fee. You can read about it here:
. https://www.howtogeek.com/273824/windows-10-without-the-cruft-windows-10-ltsb-explained/


Me neither, thought it was some minority group.


Yah- LTSB is essentially all the good parts of 7 and 10. No cortana, no apps. You get DX12 and of course you can install windows games stuff if you like. If you uninstall IE and the other few unnecessary bits, its about as lean as you can get with a standard installation image.


is there a fix for the 90 days of usage limit ?

There are tools that address KMS issues, yes. I don’t want to link anything here, but have a look around Reddit regarding ltsb, and you shouldn’t be searching for too long :slight_smile:

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After your suggestion i installed LTSC 2019 (previously called LTSB) and it runs great!

My PC still doesnt run my 5k+ tho.

@CyrilJ Do a search for KMS_VL_ALL-master


Awesome! I will say I was underwhelmed with the performance of LTSC vs LTSB, but both are leaps ahead of vanilla W10.

Gonna try LTSB soon :wink:
thanks guys @Riccardo & @Chillisix
@Riccardo do you mean LTSB is better than LTSC 2019?

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I read the article in Computerworld posted by @neal_white_iii, which was quite informative, but it did not directly explain how I, normal consumer, could get the license. I was living under impression that LTSB/LTSC was only available in Volume Licensing and paid perpetually.

@Riccardo @Chillisix how did you do that?

I want to be careful in saying one is better, but I prefer LTSB. So just to explain-

I tested them both on the same VM rig, and LTSC runs many more processes and services. I ran both VM’s and just let them idle for about 5 minutes after booting. Looking at the task manager, there was higher resource consumption across the board (CPU, RAM, Paging, etc) before I started any applications. I think in terms of day to day use, and even lighter gaming it wouldn’t affect your use too much, but under load that’s probably going to move the needle in the wrong direction.

I could have been a little more thorough and compared actual process/service resource use between LTSB and LTSC, but I’m really just doing this stuff for my own use and at the end of the day my position is simple. A nicely pared down OS does NOTHING negative for my personal use case. In fact, the less I have running in idle, the more I get out of my heavier apps (VR, 3d modeling and rendering, etc). With fewer background processes along with most of my stuff being portablized, the one detractor is a slower time to load when I first run them. There are certainly people out there that prioritize load time and things that all those background services and processes expedite. I am just not that guy :slight_smile:

Once I build my bigger rig (I think when new threadrippers hit) I will set up a Linux build and do the real-deal PCIE pass-through. At that point I could feasibly look at a real apples to apples use case for the Pimax under LTSB and C (or whatever revision is out there- D, maybe?) to look at the actual performance gains.

Oh i didnt realise there was such a difference between C and B.

I went for C simply because it is 3 years newer than B.

In any case im loving the snappiness of my new bloat free install :slight_smile:

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OK seems this isnt for me,.

Without the Microsoft store i cant download the Windows Mixed Reality Portal.

Even after hacking the store in it says WMR doesnt work on my windows version.

I guess ill have a crack at Windows 10 Enterprise instead.


Drivers required to run the 20xx generation of nVidia cards refuse to install on LTSB.
I tried and had to give up and install regular Win10.
Just saying.


Interesting. Sorry it didn’t work out. Did you see the nature of the issue? Did you install .NET Framework?

With LTSC i was able to use latest Nvidia drivers.

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It said the drivers could not be installed on this version of Windows. I researched the issue extensively, and it seems some drivers have a minimum winver they are built for. I tried hacking the installer’s ini files without success.

Glad to hear 2080 owners can run LTSC. Hope it brings a better experience for y’all.

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Bit of a necro but just wanted to put this out there. LTSB is the long term servicing branch which is now named long term servicing channel…thus ltsb and ltsc.

They are basically w10 without edge, cortana, UWP, apps and the windows store, they do NOT receive feature updates only security updates. They are updates every 3 years so the latest ltsc (there are no more ltsb as it called ltsc now) is the LTSC 2019 which is updated with features up to the regular w10 1809.

This means LTSC 2019 has the 1709 fall creators update which is require for WMR. That said I dunno if the windows store is require…I do believe you should be able to simply use WMR for steamVR

Not having WMR headset I can’t really test it myself though.

I now it a bit of an older thread but since I will be build a new PV just for VR soonish (when the new ryzen cpu’s come out) I have been doing some research on w10 as the 3 PC I do have are all currently running happily on windows 7.