Its not quite true. They have shared their opinion, pimax has listened and thats how m1 evolved to m2. End point. No further workout required and expected. I have told that month ago, its clear as day and night that m2 is a final product (talking about hardware) and pimax will not accept any delays anymore, therefore there is no point to send m2 to each and every tester waiting for their responds, as soon each backer will receive his device called “final” although its the m2.
So did Pimax let testers influence final product? For sure.
Exactly, that’s what pimax got out of it. And sure, that’s beneficial to all of the backers, including the Spanish group, agreed. But you must agree that all of the testers were promised reviews and if you cut out the guys who you expect to do the least positive reviews, then that’s very unethical at best.
Yes, its a lit bit confusing that some testers going to receive m2 while others not. But i wouldn’t worry about that much, because their reviews are no more relevant for the headset development itself. Their opinion might be interesting for backers during the short time until we receive our own headsets to try this out and create our own vision of what we were promised and received so far.
There are a lot of accusations flying here and I want to throw 2 cents in on some things.
On the advantage of cutting the Spanish testers out. Which do you realistically think does more damage to pimax for the people who would be fans of the Spanish testers and read their review. An article titled , ‘the 8k is deeply flawed , switch to 5 k if you backed or don’t buy if you didn’t’ or an article titled ’ pimax silenced us from speaking about the m1 and refused us an m2 , and that says more than we could’.
On calculation and malice of pimax. Mrtv and voodoo didn’t know they were getting headsets until they met pimax in Berlin, which caused a freakout on here . They brought the same three shitty games no one likes. They brought literally no one fluent in English and were surprised mrtv spoke Chinese. They brought no pimax livery. They presented in sweatpants and demo’d porn. They decided the name of the the 5k plus literally on a whim. They originally wanted the pro version of the headset to look like ironman with fake painted on screw heads. I honest to god do not think pimax has the organisational capacity to be malicious in a way designed to benefit themselves
I think @Heliosurge only heard that xunshu was going to send us the headsets and interpreted that we would receive the M2 very soon after the others, it’s understandable.
I have seen that it has created controversy and the truth is that I didn’t want to continue reading.
Haha I laughed out loud. You do have a point and it also seems that that’s MRTV’s interpretation right now, that Pimax is just ‘doing things’, without thinking any of it through. At all. Could be. I don’t know if that explanation makes it much better though.
It could be malice or It could be slack on Pimax part, It doesn’t change the fact that what they did is unfair to the spanish testers and not what Pimax stated in their beta testers announcement. If i understood correctly, this is something both @heliosurge and @Sjef agree, so i think it’s a shame they came to such low terms at each other. I personally could not care less for some “testers” that proved themselves useless at best and hypocrite leechers at worst. But that’s not the case with the spanish testers. They did test the HMD, and It was written nowhere that they had to like what they found, so they had the right to receive the M2 in the beta test phase.
What we want to you know as backers is your personal preference based on your time with both ! But also the reasoning and though processes you go through to make your decision. (assuming you use controlled testing)
Having tried both, you are in a position to do a functional side by side comparison of the two models whilst also being able to directly control the configurational setup to a control based standard. This is a position that is not available to the majority of us…
We don’t need information about ‘how to use it’. Most of us would already know or can figure that out.
We are interested in the quality, performance, sde, distortion, latency and affects whilst playing games or using virtual environments such as bigscreen…
If your goal is just to say here are the 5k+ and 8k and that they are similar then that is not good enough from a critical lens viewpoint.
As an 8k backer I would want to know whether whether the $100+ (could be more at retail) price difference is justifiable between the two from a performance and visual quality perspective. How are we supposed to know if if we are to downgrade if we cannot even have a chance to try it.
Your opinion is important for us as it is one of the few voices that can help us make the decision based on our setup and needs. Yes give us facts, but also give us your personal opinion and your reasoning based on testing and methodology, because that is the true purpose of a review. Weigh up with well weighted opinions based on the testing, otherwise, it is not a review, it is just a video demonstration after which we as backers might end up still frustrated and confused after watching.
As an example, your berlin videos were much appreciated, but due to the environment, high subjectivity and lack of a proper test control environment, that just provided us with a lot of subjective confusion.
Also please factor in whether a 2080 Ti in future might swing the opinion
sweviver literally and i mean LITERALLY said "[quote=“SweViver, post:216, topic:8042”]
You already know that I think its the best HMDs on the market. So no surprise there.
[/quote]
…
And pimax is releasing this at the end of the month regardless of whether or not they “greenlight” it or not. (Hint, they won’t even mention it…)
exactly this. They want a perfect headset. I don’t. Most of us don’t. A “perfect” headset won’t come until after 2025. They can’t keep on improving it and improving it, they have to release at some point and now is the perfect time where it’s already the best headset on the market. THIS is why i am actually glad they won’t get they headset early like the other 3. I’m not really interested in watching a video from them where they say stuff like “they could’ve done this and that to perfect the headset, it’s not acceptable in its current state” nahh i’m good.
People were clamouring over themselves to be testers. Who wouldn’t want to be sent an engineering sample of a new product in their hobby? It’s free and you get to try it before anyone else.
I’d do it. Everyone else wanted to do it. Most of us however lack the experience, or time, or hardware to be good testers.
I doubt the Spanish group did it purely to post a review. In that sense they are owed nothing more by Pimax. Especially if they are making unrealistic requests like a total redesign of lenses etc.
Just because something can be better doesn’t mean it must be made that way regardless of cost or time. See Star Citizen.
If the majority of backers liked what they saw at Berlin then Pimax have probably reached an acceptable compromise of quality, cost and development time (already delayed) for a release candidate.
The work ALL the testers have done is valuable, especially with a team like Pimax, who are prone to making very amateurish mistakes. I’ve no doubt the product is better, prob much better, for it. But that’s the point of beta testers. For that we owe them our gratitude. But that’s really where it ends.
Their opinions do matter though if they offered objective and useful functional and practical advice for the iteration that that they were provided.If some of what they said helped to improve the M1 to M2 then they have helped to improve the it which we should be thankful for.
Obviously if they chose not to look for objective ways to improve the model and tried to take this back to ground 0, then it would not be practical. I’m hoping that most of them did provide useful advice. I do think it would be fair that they get a shot at the M2 though to determine if there were improvements made.
However, I would hope that they remain objective and neutral in light of the occurances, and choose to be professional with how they approach their review. That might be harder to do if they felt that they were being hard done by or ignored.
I did feel though that when Spanish testers were making their case for being testers, that they seemed to me to mostly be about their own self promotion though., but that is my subjective view. And I might very well be wrong there.
It is not even clear why Pimax denied them the M2 test Unit. Maybe they thought the leaks were coming from the Spanish group, maybe Pimax felt that they were pushing in a direction with their lense redesign (screen usage) thing for which the Beta Test never was meant to be.
And while we are at it maybe they wanted to send them the M2 but after @Neoskynet broke the NDA shortly before the Berlin meetup and made a drama in the public forum about the state of things in the Tester forum and his lense screen usage thing and that Pimax doesn’t listen to them maybe Pimax changed their mind at that very moment. Remember Seb and Thomas didn’t know they would receive the Units until the Berlin meetup.
I don’t say any of this is the reason but there are always 2 sides to every story.
Disclaimer: I have reviewed all the text carefully and all the information that appears in it has already been publicly revealed in the Pimax forum. There is no confidential information that could break the NDA. I can’t give out technical information specific to the M1 that hasn’t been released yet because I’m under the NDA, sorry.
I’ve avoided explaining my solution, so as not to break the NDA, but now that the information is public about my proposed solution, I can now talk freely.
God damn the level of cancer on this forum are crazy some times… To be honest I really don’t get the amount of whining and entitlement. This was a Kickstarter Project for a privately held company. You are entitled to NOTHING. Has Pimax’s communication NOT been the greatest? Yes. But why don’t you go and ask Valve how the Knuckles controllers are coming along and see what type of response you get. Point is Pimax could have gone radio silence for six months at time and it would have sucked, but they still would not have “owed” us anything.
We are getting a headset, soon, but for some reason people still can’t be grateful for that and will turn this forum into a cornea cancer educing cesspool. Lets face it we need our cornea’s. I find it disappointing that I am reading through a thread titled " update-31-10-days-countdown-m2-in-depth-reviews-are-coming-up-from-mid-sep-discussion" and mostly find people obsessed with measuring their dangly bits that they somehow seem to be confiding with their intellect.
Please I implore you all, lets just go back to how the community started with a bunch of people who were excited about VR and eager to see what Pimax was going to come up with.
Okay Folks. I am going to offer some clarity here.
Only 3 Testers have received the m2 & 5k+. The ones whom were at the backer meetup.
Testers Consisted of:
5 Youtubers
1 Freelance Reporter
1 Professor
1 Software Creator
Spanish group whom shared 1 headset.
The Spanish Team; to get an idea of their dedication shared 1 headset between them. Taking turns driving often 1 hour plus to meetup & give each of them time to test various aspects of the headset.
None of the Testers is believed to have leaked or broken the NDA. All have acted proffessionally & passionately to improve these headsets.
Many backers are wanting a broader range of info to decide on whether to stick with the 8k or swap to the 5k+. Those with low backer numbers will not have the benefit to hear from more than the 3 at the Berlin Meetup. While the 3 will do a good job presenting both Units. Some to many may want to have a broader range of Info to make this decision.
Those with higher backer numbers may have the benefit that want more info than the 3 whom have the headset can reasonably present.
But let’s stop this ridiculous train against any tester please.