Pimax 8K Plus vs 8K X

Pimax 8K Series
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I was really torn between whether to order the 8K Plus or the 8K X. I was leaning towards the 8K Plus and here are my reasons why:

  • I will most likely be using the 90Hz upscaled mode anyway to play most games because I prefer to play at 90Hz or higher. 75Hz native 4K is just slightly better refresh rate than an Oculus Quest.
  • The $300 I save could be money used towards the prescription lens adapters and eye tracking module
  • It seems the 8K Plus is more likely to have wireless in the future. The 8K X uses special cables so I don’t know if it would be possible on that headset.
  • I feel like performance on the 4K native mode would take a huge hit, even with my 2080 Ti
  • I heard the cable for the 8K X is like 5m shorter than the 8K plus. I think having a long enough cable is important. My playspace dimensions are 9.5ft x 5.5ft

But now I’m rethinking my decision and I think I’ll go for the 8K X instead for the following reasons:

  • While the 75Hz native 4K mode might have trouble running certain games smoothly, it would be nice for watching movies, browsing the web, etc.
  • I’ve already spent a lot of money on VR and $300 more is not too bad.
  • I’d still be able to switch between native and upscaled mode.

What do you guys think?

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Which decision do you feel you will regret the most? :slight_smile: then go with the opposite option :smiley:

This might not be helpful, but the 75hz on 8kx in native mode is what is currently advertised (proven to work), although no guarantees have been given, pimax has said theoretically it should be able to do 90hz in native and are working on it.

Personally if I do get one of the newer models, I’ll be going for the 8kx, it’s got everything the 8k+ has and more, as you say the clarity for movies and desktop use, performance is said to be barely any different to 8k+ anyway since you’re throwing similar resolutions at it. Although wireless might be a challenge now, there is still the consideration it might work when in upscaler mode!? obviously all to be tested, seen and proven but as with the 5k+ and it’s 120hz mode option recently… things can change!

Also the cable is not 5m shorter, it’s the same length, just any option of extending is proving more challenging.

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For some reasons, I am pretty sure the 8kx will support wireless.
But only upscaled of course.
Because actually, 8kX is only 8k+ without the upscaler activated. Highter resolution but lower refresh rate. Just like one day, they might support 120hz with narrowed FoV as the 5k+ do it now.
To me, the only difference between both headset is only the cable.
The expensive, hard to design, so hard it barely can be longer than 5m that could worth 300$ cable, since a 10m “hd” is 100$, a so much hard to make can worth 300 yes.
When turning upscaler on with the 8kX, you get a 8k+.

So longer cable and/wireless should work with it.

Of course I have no source of that beside Kevin that make clear during PD1 that the cable was almost the hardest to design.

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The 8KX should have a longer useful life. It won’t become obsolete for quite a while. It will just get even better with a GPU upgrade, since you can increase the SS. For those times when you want a higher refresh rate, you can switch to upscaled mode. I’ve used my 8K at 72 and 80 Hz and it’s been fine, so 75 Hz should be OK.

You need to weigh (in your mind) the need for wireless and a longer cable. Is the 8KX worth the tradeoffs? I only play seated games (no room for stand-up VR), so I know which I’ll be choosing (the 8KX).

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I emailed Matthew Xu asking him to cancel my order for the 8K plus so that I can order the 8KX instead.

Now I just have to decide whether to get the standard headphone version or deluxe version. One of the benefits of the Index speakers is that they float near your ears which increases the comfort and reduces heat. It also allows for your ears to naturally hear sounds nearby.

So I’m thinking the standard version might be better, even if the deluxe version ends up having better audio, because the standard one is not touching your ears.

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Because it’s modular, you can always upgrade to the deluxe version in the future, if you change your mind. I’ll likely get the deluxe headphone from the start, since I want to block outside noises.

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exactly why i choose the 8kx, in the future with a better gpu and supersampling it will be even better. I noticed that trying the Reverb.

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Anything is possible in the future. Remember how they say foveate rendering will take a long time before it actually work? Well, it’s here. So is the same with wireless. I am sure 8KX will have wireless in the future because the technology is moving fast. And pretty soon RTX 3080ti will be here in a few months. In fact, rumors has it it will be first half of 2020…likely Summer.

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If you mean FFR on Pimax (“fixed foveated rendering”) then it is there as long as you are looking straight ahead. But the real foveated rendering requires the eye tracking and much more than just applying variable rate shading to the statically defined map, and it won’t be “here” (on Pimax headset) anytime soon.

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Having tried both headsets I would say that if you can spare that 300, go for the X. If not, simply choose the 8K+, it is nearly as good, really. There is no bad headset here, just a bit of extra pixel usage in the X but the + looks just as good.

I own the 8K and the 5K+. My opinion is the 8K+ is twice as beautiful as those headsets. And the X adds another 25% or so

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The index ones are still near your ears though, not basically on top of your head like pimax seem to have gone for

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The reactualised bandwidth matters reactualise a question that was asked several times while we were waiting for the kickstarter products to finish development:

Has any thought been directed toward lens-matched, not rendering, but transport?

With a bit of compositing circuitry on-device, you could easily send large swathes of the frame, toward the periphery, at lower resolution (whilst keeping it 1:1 in the middle, where you can tell), without it making a significant perceivable difference to quality, even without eyetracking, due to matters of oversampling in anisotropic areas of the projection, and lens field curvature.

With current devices, the answer turned out to be “no”, of course - no effort was even made to shave off the bandwith taken up by the black margins to the sides, through a simple crop job, on each frame.

But… Now they’ve had time to stew on things, and there is also the matter of just where they found room for the new 120Hz mode on some of the 5k+ units out there – so they can send a smaller frame, after all, and have it appear centered on screen… (EDIT: Positioned behind the centre of the lens, that is - not at the centre of the screen itself.)

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It all depends what you are going to use your Pimax for.

Racing Simulators (Assetto, PC2 etc):
The difference between 8KX and 8K+ is obvious, but its not huge. More clarity and more sharpness on everything, especially at far distance. Less aliasing and slightly more readable car dashboard numbers and dials. Of course, HUD text is way more easy to read on the 8KX.

Flight Simulators (Aerofly FS2, DCS, IL2 etc plus ED):
The difference between 8KX and 8K+ is slightly bigger here. Especially in DCS. Gauges way more readable and clear. More sharpness and cockpit details overall and way less aliasing on straght lines, including far distance. Again, HUD text is way more easy to read on the 8KX.

Casual VR games (Skyrim VR, The Lab, Asgards Wrath etc)
The difference between 8KX and 8K+ can vary a lot, depending on the scenario. Sometimes you wont tell any difference at all, and sometimes everything just looks twice as good on the 8KX, with less aliasing and more clarity overall. It also depends a lot on the engine. Skyrim VR is blurry AF with AA, even with a 8KX. Turn AA off and you get slight aliasing, which looks worse on a 8K+.

Desktop Work (Virtual Desktop, SteamVR desktop view etc…)
8KX wins big time. Sharpness, readibility, clarity. Its really so much better. Just like 5K+ did compared to original 8K. The upscaling kills the icon clarity, text readibility and so on. Mo matter if its very small text or not. The 8KX just has that native look.

Watching movies
Almost no difference at all between 8KX and 8K+. Slightly more aliasing on 8K+ of course, expecially if you watch 4K, 6K or 8K videos but I can live with that. The subtitles looks more sharp on the 8KX, but the subtitles are not super small, so I wouldnt say it looks bad on the 8K+ anyway (it just looks slightly less sharp). The SDE is of course the same on both 8K+ and 8KX, so thats all what matters to me when watching movies.

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Thank SweViver,
It looks like a good selection guide :+1:

I think that many people now need it, who are still in thought.

I chose 8KX a few days ago, doubting that it would be different from 8K +.
But you dispelled my doubts and now I’m glad that I chose 8KX, excellent! :beer:

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@SweViver

Was Pimax 8K+ running at 90 hz at VR days ?

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Yes it was. tralalala

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Not sure if Pimax has thought about it, but (I think it was) Sony has.

The idea is to send VR frames at the same bandwidth as a normal video frame: Each eye is rendered at half-scale (x and y, so 1/4th the data as a standard frame, per eye), then the 2 fovea regions are rendered full scale, but only half size, which is 1/4th the data). The data (4 regions at 1/4th the data) is the same bandwidth as a single standard video frame.

The downside? You need a custom (expensive) decoder/compositing chip in the headset to process the data into left and right frames. Also, it will probably add some additional lag.

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Pretty sure it won’t matter for movies at all. For 3d/SBS movies you’d need at least 8k quality with good bitrate, probably even higher, to be able to see a difference between the two headsets. And there’s not much available in that quality, even XXX rated movies are usually 4k-5k. It will take years before 8k or higher is going to be common.

And for regular movies you’re also probably looking at higher than 4k resolution for a difference.

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Possibly…

On the other hand; Meanwhile you have Tilt Five, which is a tiny company, who have their own custom chip that receives (rather low framerate, and only 720p) imagery over USB, drives the projectors in the devices, handles the tracking of position and hands, and does reprojection on-headset…

Granted, much of this was developed during a previous corporate incarnation of the technology, when they had a ton of venture capital (which eventually rotted the company from inside, when directors were brought in, took over control from the founders, and went on a hubristic spending spree), but much of that work was well underway and prototyped already in the small startup days of CastAR, as that first company was called. (EDIT: ….and also irregardelss of the fact that that in turn built on work the founders had done while working at Valve software.)

It’s going to be interesting to see whether their product lives up to even a fragment of its moderate hype. :7

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Posts like this should be stickied to a megathread.
Really, good information is so hard to find in this forum, you need to go on a treasure hunt.

Thanks, Martin.

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